Am I a pastor?
This is an argument that has gone on as long as our movement has associated itself with the main-line of Christianity. As a Salvation Army officer, I know I have a pastoral role. According to scripture, there are some who have the gift of being pastors. I am not sure that ordination makes one a pastor.
I think therein lies the rub. I have the sinking feeling that the church has become so efficient in setting up its systems that the role of pastor has not only become a spiritual gifting and calling, but a career move. Pastors are often appointed in the church. For historical reasons probably having to do with the adoption of Christianity as the official religion of the Roman Empire, the church began to set up the hierarchy of pastor/parishioner. This is now our standard system. This may not be completely biblical.
Many will point to apostolic appointments by Jesus and then the apostles appointing leaders (elders)in the church to alleviate some of the day to day operation of the church as the reason for this set up. In the scheme of things there may be some validity to this. I would submit, however, this was done to facilitate service and not set up a hierarchy.
Today, the connotation of pastor is often one who knows more than those under their care. There could be some truth to that fact given some advanced degree or certificate work, but let's face it, it is not always true. In fact, how many times have those of us in the clergy been taught some great scriptural truths by some little grandma, who has no degree, but has read and prayed her way through the scripture? For that matter, how many times have we been taught by a teenager, with a fresh commitment to Christ, who is ravenous in their appetite for that things of God?
In fact, to think that the ordination of one makes them better is theologically weak. I have recently had this discussion with some officer friends of mine, who feel they cannot "be vulnerable or honest" in settings where lay people who are in ministry are in attendance. It may well be that our whole rank system is theologically indefensible.
I love my calling to be an officer and serve the poor. I wonder, though, what makes a pastor? Is it an ordination or a relationship? Is it a gift or a certificate that makes one a pastor? Are we really better or just different than those who are also in ministry? What really makes a leader or pastor? Am I a pastor? I am struggling with that.
What do you think?
I think therein lies the rub. I have the sinking feeling that the church has become so efficient in setting up its systems that the role of pastor has not only become a spiritual gifting and calling, but a career move. Pastors are often appointed in the church. For historical reasons probably having to do with the adoption of Christianity as the official religion of the Roman Empire, the church began to set up the hierarchy of pastor/parishioner. This is now our standard system. This may not be completely biblical.
Many will point to apostolic appointments by Jesus and then the apostles appointing leaders (elders)in the church to alleviate some of the day to day operation of the church as the reason for this set up. In the scheme of things there may be some validity to this. I would submit, however, this was done to facilitate service and not set up a hierarchy.
Today, the connotation of pastor is often one who knows more than those under their care. There could be some truth to that fact given some advanced degree or certificate work, but let's face it, it is not always true. In fact, how many times have those of us in the clergy been taught some great scriptural truths by some little grandma, who has no degree, but has read and prayed her way through the scripture? For that matter, how many times have we been taught by a teenager, with a fresh commitment to Christ, who is ravenous in their appetite for that things of God?
In fact, to think that the ordination of one makes them better is theologically weak. I have recently had this discussion with some officer friends of mine, who feel they cannot "be vulnerable or honest" in settings where lay people who are in ministry are in attendance. It may well be that our whole rank system is theologically indefensible.
I love my calling to be an officer and serve the poor. I wonder, though, what makes a pastor? Is it an ordination or a relationship? Is it a gift or a certificate that makes one a pastor? Are we really better or just different than those who are also in ministry? What really makes a leader or pastor? Am I a pastor? I am struggling with that.
What do you think?
posted by Larry at 3:43 PM
8 Comments:
First of all, gifting and action makes somebody a pastor. And here’s where I could go off on a wild tangent about how today’s pastors are expected to pastor, teach, prophesy (depending on how you define that word), administrate, lead worship, etc, no matter what their actual gifting is. Surely that is not how New Testament church leadership worked? But I digress.
If you’re pastoring somebody, you’re a pastor. If you actually have the gift of pastoral ministry, you’re probably pastoring somebody well. Having the gift does not make you a pastor, you must use it. Just like having an ordination certificate does not make you a minister, you must actually be ministering to somebody.
Can I also just say that I have a much higher level of respect for church leaders (of any kind) who are honest and vulnerable in front of their people. It’s easy to keep your struggles to yourself, claiming that you don’t want to cause other people to stumble, but don’t you think that what it really boils down to is pride?
I have the same questions that you do Larry and, if we have pastoral gifts and work at DHQ/THQ/IHQ, I think we have to work a little harder to find outlets for those gifts.
Tim,
I agree with what you have posted. Most of it at least. As a Corps Officer I don't consider myself a Pastor. Some days I don't consider myself a Corps Officer!
I do take a 180 on your last statement though. There seems to be, at least from where I sit, an equal opportunity for gift outlets at THQ, DHQ, IHQ. Unless of course you have a tyrannical leader that won't let anyone stray off the duties of "work". Officers at the HQ'S have the capacity to be involved with Corps to the extent they want to.
Hopefully I am making sense. I don't fully know what goes on at the Headquarters level. The stigma that we Corps Officers often imply is that it is easy, and a place to aspire to. I don't think it is easy and if God ever calls me to Headquarters of any kind I would go, but my lifes ambition is not DHQ.
At this particular point as I am sitting in my office the only thing I can truely say I am, is a sinner saved by the Grace of God and I want others to experience that same grace.
the word pastor is from the Latin for shepherd - and so yes, I function as a shepherd, walking alongside, sometimes rescuing, often just listening. I do see it more as a matter of function - I did not see myself as a pastor while in an administrative role, as I had no congregation to lead (Webster's definition). That was the role of another during those days.
As for vulnerability, I desire to be vulnerable to my congregation, not in the sense of airing dirty laundry or working out my own therapy through the pulpit, but with a willingness to laugh and weep, to curse the darkness and rejoice in the light, and to admit that God is as much of a mystery at times for me as he may be for them. I don't see the issue with ordained or non-ordained, lay or officer - it is about being open and honest about who I am within the context I'm in.
Brother Larry,
Andre Burton here...new to this medium of communication, aka blogging, as a result of our brother Jim Knaggs.
Just finished reading your recent post. Good Stuff! And what continues to stand out in my mind after reading it is this:
"it may well be that our whole rank system is theologically indefensible." Wow! If proven to be such then there's a list of people who need to sign up for a new identity! No criticism/sacrasm intended. Perhaps you'll agree with rank comes priviledge...and ego is not too far behind. This usually peeks when appointed to either a hq position (no reflection on you or Janet). It must be something in the water?
Andre,
Good to hear from you. I may be posting on the issue of the rank system pretty soon. I am struggling with it right now.
Robyn,
Can you really declare yourself to be a pastor? Doesn't someone need to identify you as "their" pastor?
Susan,
As to your pastoral role with the employee, just because she does not attend worship, isn't she still part of the corps? For that matter isn't anyone who comes in your door or is influenced by the work of the Army in your town, part of your corps? Isn't the world our parish?
Susan,
All of what we do should be the church.
I do appreciate the pity Robyn but you really shouldn't. What is a pastor? Tim, says gifting and action make a pastor. The explanation is well worded but the meaning is still misty. Hs says a pastor is a shepherd. That makes a bit more sense in my mind because a shepherd, shepherds in a pastor. So, Is a pastor a sower, reaper, or waterer? If I lack one am I delegated to mere minister? Do I have to be all three? Am I a pastor if I am a Corps Officer?
perhaps a glance at the early church would help...how did they "do things"? what was Yeshua's desire for us...? i believe as Christians (mini-Christs)we are all called to be "shepherds"...perhaps we should be wary of our denominations and orginizations because of the many complications of their "maintainance"...
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