I learned something at Women's retreat?
This past Sunday, I went to a Women's retreat for our division. That's what happens when you are married to the Program Secretary and the Divisional Commander, who lives around the corner from you needs a ride when his car breaks down.
Let me say that the worship gathering was sincere and people were searching after God. It was what it should have been. People wanted to know Jesus more deeply. I was encouraged and moved by that. Many in the room made fresh commitment to God. It was a joy to see.
There were some funny moments. The first hymn from was "I am a Woman." My mentor, Bill, told me he would hit me with his cain and report me to the Personnel Secretary if I actually sang it. There was also the moment during the sermon when one of my pals came out with a crown and robe. Of course, I knew she was a bit shy about it. It gave me a great opportunity to kid around. I ordered a whopper with fries after the meeting. We had a great laugh. Well, at least I did.
I have often blogged about my reaction to different presentations of the Gospel. I love to tussle and struggle with the deep theology of the church. There wasn't much of that there. I am not saying for a moment that the Gospel was dumbed down or presented in a way that came as a result of a lack of preparation. It was simple.
Because of my ADHD, both physical (and sometimes spiritual), my attention wandered. My focus was lost. I was not challenged much.
At this point in my blogs I would probably launch into some thesis on the need for us to get beyond the basics and go to the deep. I do believe we have bred in our Movement inch-deep Christians over the years. This was different.
For one of the first times in a very long time, even though I was not challenged by what was going on, I was challenged by a Voice deep within. I heard almost as clear as day, "Stop being selfish. It is not about you."
I count myself among those who believe the Church needs to change and deepen. I am one who believes that we do so many things out of rote actions that our worship is shallow. I believe that we can do so much more. I am somewhat of a cynic when it comes to Evangelicalism as it has evolved over the years. I believe a watered-down theology has led us to be ultra-conservatives, who barely resemble what our forerunners like John Wesley who were progressive in their views. We also need to value the opinions and views of other traditions. It sharpens us.
Yet for that moment, I believe that simple and traditional worked. Maybe it was the crowd. Maybe it was the loss of my pre-conceived emergent ideas. It worked.
The fact is, it was not the style. It was not the content. God worked because or in spite of all that went on.
I learned something at Women's retreat about God's moving. I do have questions though. Of course, I have. Is simple always best? How much does depend on us when it comes to the presentation of the Gospel? Are we too self-important? Has the church become too concerned about style of worship? Is a church meeting all that important?
As with all my blogs I want to know, what do you think?
Let me say that the worship gathering was sincere and people were searching after God. It was what it should have been. People wanted to know Jesus more deeply. I was encouraged and moved by that. Many in the room made fresh commitment to God. It was a joy to see.
There were some funny moments. The first hymn from was "I am a Woman." My mentor, Bill, told me he would hit me with his cain and report me to the Personnel Secretary if I actually sang it. There was also the moment during the sermon when one of my pals came out with a crown and robe. Of course, I knew she was a bit shy about it. It gave me a great opportunity to kid around. I ordered a whopper with fries after the meeting. We had a great laugh. Well, at least I did.
I have often blogged about my reaction to different presentations of the Gospel. I love to tussle and struggle with the deep theology of the church. There wasn't much of that there. I am not saying for a moment that the Gospel was dumbed down or presented in a way that came as a result of a lack of preparation. It was simple.
Because of my ADHD, both physical (and sometimes spiritual), my attention wandered. My focus was lost. I was not challenged much.
At this point in my blogs I would probably launch into some thesis on the need for us to get beyond the basics and go to the deep. I do believe we have bred in our Movement inch-deep Christians over the years. This was different.
For one of the first times in a very long time, even though I was not challenged by what was going on, I was challenged by a Voice deep within. I heard almost as clear as day, "Stop being selfish. It is not about you."
I count myself among those who believe the Church needs to change and deepen. I am one who believes that we do so many things out of rote actions that our worship is shallow. I believe that we can do so much more. I am somewhat of a cynic when it comes to Evangelicalism as it has evolved over the years. I believe a watered-down theology has led us to be ultra-conservatives, who barely resemble what our forerunners like John Wesley who were progressive in their views. We also need to value the opinions and views of other traditions. It sharpens us.
Yet for that moment, I believe that simple and traditional worked. Maybe it was the crowd. Maybe it was the loss of my pre-conceived emergent ideas. It worked.
The fact is, it was not the style. It was not the content. God worked because or in spite of all that went on.
I learned something at Women's retreat about God's moving. I do have questions though. Of course, I have. Is simple always best? How much does depend on us when it comes to the presentation of the Gospel? Are we too self-important? Has the church become too concerned about style of worship? Is a church meeting all that important?
As with all my blogs I want to know, what do you think?
posted by Larry at 6:49 PM
5 Comments:
Yes, the church has always been far too concerned about style of worship. But that goes both ways. For those old schoolers who have a death grip on the style of worship, they worry too much. But for those of us who continue to try and get it changed, we too often miss the point. Let me be clear, while the attitude behind it all is most important, keep in mind that the egotistical rock star worship leader isn’t any more wrong than the old school hierarchical sergeant major/deacon. They both miss the point when they believe that only their particular style of worship will bring in lost people and help to make converts. (though I cannot write that without mentioning that I have a hard time believing that the old schoolers really believe that their style will bring in new people. I’d like to think that, even at my most selfish, there is that basic belief that “my” style will reach new people. And, at the very least, I have some very misleading statistics that suggest that this is so. What in the world are the old schoolers pointing to at this point???)
Anyway, all that to point out that it’s not the worship service which is most important, it’s the community. That said, if people aren’t being challenged, you’ve got two problems. The first is with those who leave, looking to be challenged. The second is with the people who stay, who don’t care that they’re not being challenged or, worse, ARE being challenged through very surface level worship and sermons. That’s bad news for any church that hopes to be a relevant and growing community.
Sorry, my daughter is watching cartoons in the background and I have no idea if any of the above is a cohesive thought. ???
I was there as well, and had some of the same reaction. I've been doing this long enough to realize that generally the goals for Home League Camp (which this really was) do not tend to include 'tussling with the deep theology of the church.' With the exception of when Danielle Strickland spoke, I can't remember a gathering of this type that made much of a personal impact for me. It is what it is. If I am asked to provide leadership or planning input for a group like this, then I would hope to guide in a different direction, but I don't anticipate being welcomed to that discussion.
Since you mentioned it, for me, the stage was set with the song that Bill didn't want to sing. "I am a woman." I looked for the words on the internet, but couldn't find them - however, the first verse in particular is troublesome, for it paints a woman as one who is a servant, obedient -true for all of us, male or female, but not specifically and necessarily the first descriptor for women, especially in TSA. As Andrew Eason understands, women in TSA need to "guard against self-abnegation and diminished agency. Self-denial may have been a message heard by Army men and women, but women were invariably the ones called upon to practise it at every level of the organization."
I want more for the women from my corps. I want them to be strengthened and empowered, to be stretched and challenged. If verse one is 'called to be a servant,' then verse 2 must be, 'called to be a leader'
Good questions.
I've been in well planned meetings and meetings that were off the cuff, in both the Spirit did not move. We wondered what went wrong.
I've been in traditional meetings and all out get loud for Jesus meetings and the Spirit moved in both. We wondered what we did right.
I've seen the alter full of people when the message never included a bible verse and I've seen it empty when the message was delivered with power and a strong word from scripture.
Maybe the moving of the Spirit has nothing to do with any of these things..or very little?
Maybe it really is just grace and no matter what...the attitude of our hearts when we worship him.
I think the key is found in your post.. "the worship gathering was sincere and people were searching for God. People wanted to know Jesus more deeply."
I feel strongly about us needing more knowledge of the Word of God. We need depth. Head knowledge to match the zeal of our hearts.
How do we do this and still come as children to worship in simplicity? How do we find the balance?
I hope you don't mind a bit of cheeky-ness, but this post made me smile at your willingness to show how open minded you are.
I'm not talking about worship styles, or even attendace at a women's retreat. But if you read your second sentence again, because of some missing punctuation, it give the distinct impression that you are married to the Program Secretary AND the D.C.
;-)
No kidding...you're right..haha!
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